Warning: call_user_func_array() expects parameter 2 to be array, null given in /usr/www/virtual/liftstudios/www.titusandryan.com/wp-includes/functions.php on line 1003 Craig Titus & Kelly Ryan Investigation » Blog Archive » Titus & Ryan back in court on 2/23/07

Titus & Ryan back in court on 2/23/07

It appears that the state is ready to try the case and Mr. Saggese, Craig Titus’ lawyer, is not ready to take this to trial. It’s clear from the notes that the state is not the one delaying the trial and are definitely providing a speedy trial. We can only imagine everyone involved in this case is ready to put it behind them or at least attempt to have some sense of closure, whatever that may be. If the trial is delayed until 2008, it will only further the hurt and anguish for everyone involved.

Notes from the last court appearance:

Court noted it placed this matter on calendar as it is a major case to handle and coordinate and it wants to check periodically to make sure everyone is ready. Mr. Daskas announced ready. Mr. Saggese stated there are some problems with experts and he cannot definitely state that the defense is ready but he will know within 30 days. Further, he intends to file a motion to request assistance to pay for and receive funds for experts. Mr. Denue stated he will be ready but if Mr. Saggese needs more time, Mr. Denue cannot oppose Mr. Saggese’s request for continuance if a motion is made at that time. Further advised, 99% of Mr. Denue’s investigation has been completed barring any new evidence and he does have an expert. Mr. Daskas advised the State would have been ready for trial on the January 2007 date. Further, both he and Mr. Tomsheck have arranged their trial schedules around the instant case and if this matter needs to be continued beyond the April 2007 date, it may need to be rescheduled to 2008. Court stated this matter will be heard by the end of the year and ORDERED, matter CONTINUED and counsel are to tell the Court at the next date absolutely, positively whether they will be ready for trial on the April 2007 date. If not, counsel are to be prepared to articulate why not.

COURT FURTHER ORDERED, deft. Gross’s presence waived this date.

108 Responses to “Titus & Ryan back in court on 2/23/07”

  1. darkstar Says:

    It would seem then that KR has got defense money…if Denue is ready to go and has experts in place, etc…

    …and that CT does not, judging from the transcript above…

    This has all the makings of a giant clusterf***…


  2. wayne mortensen Says:

    Where are all of those buddies when CT needs them. He could use a few bucks now and I see KR is not really helping CT even though she seems equally culpable as CT.
    I wonder why CTs lawyer has not told him to roll over and fry KR. She is just as quilty as him. CTs buddies at the gym needs to have a car wash, shirt sale, autographed pics of CT and his muscles. Oh, I forgot, no one really cares now.

  3. chainsaw Says:

    Why isn’t Saggase going with Denue’s experts. Do they not suit his needs. Is this just a ploy for a continuance. Is Saggase and Denue trying to get them tried seperately so they can point the finger at eachother and possibly get off? Discuss.

  4. shockandawe Says:

    I think the message is clear Chain: Denue does NOT want his client associated with Craig in any way, shape or form. I will state here now, that I believe Kelly, while not actively rolling over on Craig, is definitely on the same page with her attorney, dad, family, etc.. in terms of making a case for abused wife, mentally abused by “having” to swing and take on that life, etc.. If you knew Kelly, as I have, she is a passive player in the best sense of the word. She knows how to finesse this situation, without raising the ire of her husband, etc.. She can hide in that because Craig hangs himself all on his own and she knows she doesn’t need to lift a finger to make him look bad - he does that all on his own. He is the most unsympathetic character imaginable. She, without him and before him, is definitely capable of being a sympathetic character to jury, etc.. They will see her as a poor wretch.
    She will probably NOT take the stand at all, and her attorney will distance her and their whole case from Craig. I believe that is the ONLY chance she has. She has been a “fair player” and stating that she would never turn on Craig and that their marriage is strong, etc…. etc… etc… because she is trying to protect herself from Craig NOT rolling over on her.

    I predict that, provided Craig does not roll over on her (and he won’t, I don’t believe - not that anyone would believe him at this point and she knows this) she will get off with 3-5 years. She will have a life, I predict.

    I predict he will not. He will spend the rest of his life in prison, if not on death row.

  5. darkstar Says:


    It really has nothing to do with whether Denue’s expert suits CT’s needs as well…they are paid to testify, and that is pretty much the whole story. No money, no honey….apparently KR has it and CT doesnt…

    Trying CT and KR jointly will be interesting. Each attorney will be looking out for their client, and watch for accusations to fly between Denue and Saggese…

    If they did separate the trials, it is unlikely they would be held at the same time…that would open up the possibility that for example, if one is convicted (say KR, since her trial would likely go first) that CT might then cop a plea (if offered), or if she is acquitted, CT would probably then go to trial and take his chances…

    Whether tried together (as it appears at this point they will be) or separate, they will be pointing fingers…it is going to be nasty. I cannot envision them each taking equal blame…

    I don’t think either will get off scot free……there is too much culpability spread between them…


  6. shockandawe Says:

    Sorry, to protect herself from Craig rolling on her.

  7. darkstar Says:


    Those are good points you make. I can totally see Denue playing it just as you said.

    It will be interesting to see how long Saggese remains CT’s attorney of record…


  8. chainsaw Says:

    I think you both are wrong. They are going to go all for it together and say this girl died of an overdose. You watch. I don’t for one second believe that KR will have a life. She injected MJ with morphine, and punched her while sleeping. KR had a motive to kill, CT didn’t seem to as much. KR is no angel, I don’t belive that for a second. She has had problems from her childhood from what I understand. I don’t think she was battered or abused in anyway, if I’m wrong shock: than please inform me. There certainly is no public record of it.

  9. darkstar Says:


    Not sure how one can be wrong when I discussed both sides of the issue and didnt take a position…

    You may be right that they will have a joint trial. It is also possible that a motion will be made, by KR most likely, to sever her trial from CT.

    I also think you are putting too much reliance on the GJ transcripts. The rules for GJ hearings are different from trial procedure. The GJ purpose is simply to find if there is enough probable cause to indict. There is no reason for the GJ to hear all the evidence, or conflicting evidence for that matter…At this point I have to believe they are equally culpable.

    The overdose theory might work if it wasnt for that pesky taser, being punched and body slammed, and an allegation that either CT or KR stuck her full of dope…

    She may have overdosed, but very likely not by her own hand…that would be murder…plus, motive is not an element nor is it relevant to the substantive side of the crime…we have to be careful not to confuse “motive” with “intention”…Motive has more influence at sentencing than anything else…

    By your own theory above, I think it will be damn hard for them to claim self induced OD…


  10. chainsaw Says:


    I agree with you entirely. I’m thinkin that if Saggase doesn’t want to go, Denue will ask for them to be tried seperately. I think that this is the only chance that they both have to get off with a lighter sentance i.e manslaughter or 2nd degree murder if they plead out.

    We’ll have to wait and see. I change my own views quite frequently as well if you look back at my posts. I mean with new evidence coming out, and us getting to know CT rather more than we wish too, we have no choice.

  11. darkstar Says:


    What new evidence? Not sure what you mean by that.

    Also, I would not necessarily agree that separate trials will afford them any substantial advantage. And there is no guarantee or even a hint that any plea bargains will be offered.

    We will see what happens if Saggese can get your tax money to buy an expert for CT…at that point, the trial should get moving.


  12. JS Says:

    Hello everyone! I’ve been following this CT/KR case via this blog, and i have to say i’ve almost become addicted to this site. And the fact that I live in Finland (sorry about my english, its not my mother tongue) causes that the only information that i can get about this subject is via web.
    One thing I am a bit concerned though, is this guy Dennis Bates. I was just browsing his site again, and everytime i visit that site i found my self even more worried. I mean, i consider myself a good Christian, but if i was this mans neighbour, i would be a bit worried about my security. Dennis, i know critical mind is good thing to have, but dont you think that AT LEAST some of the things you say about Weiders connection to Satan, are JUST A BIT overreacting. My favorite part that made me pretty amused is this “We’re gonna convert you!” advertisement (http://www.musclemissions.org/public/106.cfm) which is advertising a convertible workout bench, and you are making this a subject of converting to other religions. IF Weider had some connections to Satan, and you think that they are secretly trying to convert you via magazines, then why, for example, they feature bodybuilders with tattooed crosses? Now is that Weiders secret attempt to convert atheists etc to believe into Christian religion?
    I know this message would suit better musclemissions.org site, and i apologize writing it here, just had to say something about this subject.

  13. JS Says:

    Ooops, look at how the advertisement sentence turned out to look, i hope you Dennis will not think that i made it on purpose, i really didnt. That isnt my way of trying to convert anyone to anything. I dont have a way. I dont convert people.

  14. chainsaw Says:


    All I can say is…. “IT Takes all Kinds.”

  15. NevadaLaw Says:

    DARKSTAR. Great Job!! “motive” with “intention”. I think you are 110% on the Money as to the way things will go down.

  16. 29605 Says:

    KR was not abused in any way while she was growing up physically. She grew up in a 5000-6000 square foot home with a pool and many friends. However, here father constantly critisized her and her Mom about their weight, looks, etc. This lead her to bulemia

  17. darkstar Says:


    Well, we will see…it has a ways to go, but that is how I see it as of now anyway…

    Saggese is reaching the point of sh** or get off the pot here pretty quickly, what with Denue ready to go, and the DA ready to go…if Saggese calls for many more delays, the court is going to start getting irritated at him.


  18. Venice Says:


    I’d be interested to hear more of what you know about KR and her relationship with her dad.

    How did she get to this point?

    She is responsible for her own actions, however, I feel - and it’s really just a feeling that if Craig didn’t come into her life - she wouldn’t be in this situation and her life would be much different.

    Your thoughts?

  19. fill banner Says:

    Craig Titus is in deep need of money!! CT the “KILLER” is going to spend the rest of his life getting the “ass fucking” he needs!! What the shit is Saggese going to do? “0″ Saggese has reached the point of ( MONEY!!!!)

  20. Johnny2007 Says:

    Fill Banner is right…now that Craig doesn’t have money cuming in from having house guests stay over to oogle over his body or clients to purchase their roids from him. Let’s remember…this kind of lifestyle costs thousands and thousands of dollars. I’d still like to know why ALL bodybilders are so hush hush about all the juice they do. I mean c’mon, none of them are getting big the way they are by a certain workout regemen, or using this or that Weider supplements, or the “latest” XXX designed by these supplement companies and used by “so and so” bodybuilder to look that way. Bodybuilding has become one big lie as to how one gets to become that big of a freakazoid monster. Isn’t it funny that Arnold wouldn’t even be a top 10 bodybuilder today if he competed…just because of ALL the drugs…new and old that these guys are pumping into their bodies?? As to Wayne’s comment about why CT’s gym buddies are not holding a “car wash” or “shirt sale” (lol) to raise money for his defense: (1) NONE of those Gold’s Gym Venice boys are gonna get near him because he’s now “bad news” to be associated with…(2) CT is one person knocked off the tops of the bodybuilding food chain to compete against…and (3) they’ve all found new sources for their steroid habits. I’d love to see the day when “profesional” bodybuilders are held to being honest about their sport by true verification through drug testing that what they have achieved is done through hard work…and not injecting their bodies with drugs and chemicals. Otherwise what we really have a a sport here are a bunch of drug addicts addicted to the stuff and the sport…and the results climaxing with a human being being killed because of it. Sounds like another typical case of roid rage and drug abuse gone awry. Let everybody see it for what it is.

  21. Johnny2007 Says:

    BTW…Imagine the anti-drug tv add that used an egg as “your brain” cracked open into a frying pan that “this is your brain on drugs”. Take 2 pics of CT: one before jail…the other as he is today. Nice comparison of what steroids really do to a human body…let alone the affects they had on his brain. I was once told by a MAJOR bb who is now ranked top 20 in the world how he got around the whole roid rage thing: TRANQUILIZERS…and sometimes smoking pot helped. To help him get to sleep he uses GHB or sleeping pills…to knock himself out from the steroid effects keeping him awake! WE however used GHB when we had our drug and sex session(s)…used along with crystal meth. He turned me onto the combo in my drug days of the past. Just shows U whats out there

  22. chainsaw Says:

    Need I say, ridiculous.

  23. formerfitness Says:

    Just one more thought……

    remember the justification “what a dead body would do to our ‘careers’??”

    I have since read elsewhere Kelly had already retired fitness?? There had already been a ‘retirement party (drug fest)’ And so, what ‘career’ would this alibi refer back too???? Anyone know why Kelly stopped competing?? I know repetitive fitness moves are killer on the aging joints but I didn’t know she had stopped competing. I thought she had just sat out a major show or two. Anyone out there comment?? I have been away from ‘the fitness scene’ for awhile. just curious. Also, was Craig still doing major shows prior to the arrest?

  24. 29605 Says:

    I have known Kelly for about 17 years. How she got to this point is anyone’s guess, but she has always suffered from not having confidence in her appearance. This was due, mostly, from her fathers constant complaints in her appearance.

    I have never met Craig, but Kelly was always fun to be around and the life of the party before she met him. I believe her lack of confidence led her down this road without having the confidence for standing up for what is right.

  25. Click To View Video Says:

    JS from Finland,

    You asked:

    “IF Weider had some connections to Satan, and you think that they are secretly trying to convert you via magazines, then why, for example, they feature bodybuilders with tattooed crosses?”

    I have put together a YouTube video in response to your question. Just click above where it reads: Click To View Video

    Dennis L. Bates

  26. darkstar Says:

    Mr. Bates,

    I dont know what your beef with the Weider’s is, but your argument is completely unconvincing.

    Forgive my candidness, sir, but I think you are full of shit.


  27. Click To View Video Says:

    The contents of this video speaks for itself.

  28. Administrator Says:

    Mr. Bates,

    With all due respect, that video did nothing to answer the question about why some boydbuilders have tattoed crosses. The only thing is did was again attemtp to push your agenda with the Weiders. We’d have to agree with d* on this one.

    Many bodybuilders will be at the Ironman Pro and Arnold Classic, will you be there Mr. Bates to help these lost bodybuilders, find their way?

    What any of this has to do with Titus or Ryan, we’re not sure of but let’s try to keep things relevant to this case and not Mr. Bates’ mission.

  29. Click To View Video Says:


    The video was in response to a question that was asked by someone on your site.

    We have been at the Arnold Classic for the last 6 years handing out the book “Anabolic Outlaw” freely to anyone who wanted a copy. It can also be read freely online at our site.

    The book is a Christian testimony. The sub-title is “I was a drug dealing, pot smoking, cocaine snorting, pill popping, acid dropping, whiskey drinking, steroid shooting bodybuilder!” Yes, this is my testimony.

    Craig Titus mentioned to me that the reason bodybuilders refuse to read it, is that they do not want to hear the truth. His answer was in response to my asking him why he refused a copy from us one particular year we were at the Arnold.

    After 6 years at the Arnold Classic, visitors who come from all over the world have become familiar with our mission. Many will walk the other direction when they see us approaching.

    They refuse to face the truth much like you have demonstrated in regards to this video.

    And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

    For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.

    - John 3:19,20 (KJV)

  30. Administrator Says:

    Mr. Bates,

    We’re aware of the question however your video did not ANSWER the question. Much like you, yourself avoid answering questions directly. Please tell us at what point in the video did it answer why bodybuilders specifically get tattoos. Why is it any different if a bodybuilder gets a cross tattoo or a stay at home mom? Are they “brainwashed” as well?

    You failed to answer a very simple, point-blank question. Will you be at the Arnold Classic helping those in attendance, become familiar with your mission this year?

    We are saddened that you feel this is the platform in which to exploit your cause. Wouldn’t a strong Christian seek to help the mother and family of the victim as much as Craig Titus?

  31. darkstar Says:

    Mr. Bates doesnt answer the question for the same reason he accuses those who refuse his book…could it be that the darkness he accuses evildoers of hiding in is the same darkness he himself is trying to hide his answer beneath?…
    …Lest his deeds be reproved???…

    Mr. Bates, enough of the biblical quotations…you are not fooling anyone.

    Answer the question.


  32. chainsaw Says:

    A good christian would pray for the weiders…..


  33. darkstar Says:

    A “good christian” would look to put his own house in order before accusing others…

    That would be my guess…


  34. JS Says:

    Dear Mr. Bates

    First of all I have to explain why I’m writing to THIS site and not musclemissions.org. The reason is simple, logging on to your discussion board isn’t free, it costs 18$/year, which I dont feel like paying for leaving just a few questions. And I apologize the admin of titusandryan.com about writing a little off topic comments on this site.
    Secondly, I want to say that I appreciate your effort on making that video for an answer. I’ve wathced it now three times, but yet I wonder if you understood my question correctly, OR, then I didnt undertand your answer (which might be possible due to the fact that I dont understand every word since english isnt my mother tongue). What I meant with the question, that isnt it kind of contradictional(?) that your saying that Weider includes satanic little hints, like obelix and some satanic logos in their magazines, yet there’s a bodybuilder showing a tattoeed cross, symbol of Christian religion, almost in every issue of their magazines. In my mind, you saying that Weider is trying to convert people with these satanic signs, is as reasonable thing to say than if an atheist would say that Weider is trying to convert people to Christian religion.
    I’m not trying to be offensive in any way, just was thinking and wanted to ask.

    Greetings from snowy Finland,


  35. chainsaw Says:

    Need I say this again. There is more satanic signs on the musclemissions website than on any other occult site.

  36. Venice Says:


    Look inside yourself and beyond your inner circle of friends…and ask people their opinions about your mission.

    You have a place - you could truly help a lot of BBs and others but you’ve gone off the deep end - your pendulum has swung from a life of drugs - to the twilite zone.

    I believe there is value in your story and life experience - but c’mon Dennis…the BB lifestyle may prove destructive for many and many of the reasons you sight are valid, but what do you truly know about the Weider’s and their religious beliefs? It’s good to have a purpose in ones life, but you have become delusional - I also see a trend toward your own mini-and I do mean mini empire and trying to cultivate a cult like following…

  37. Administrator Says:


    How nice of you to avoid our questions here, a place you choose to try and further your propoganda, but you willing address the question on getbig. When the owner of Getbig mentioned meeting you, you responded with:


    I look forward to seeing you there.


    Perhaps we will run into you as well and we can ask you some things on video. Would you be willing to do this? We assume you’ll be outside the event halls passing out your reading materials again.


  38. Johnny2007 Says:

    I can appreciate “Click To View Video’s” effort to distribute the book Anabolic Outlaw…although I personally think “Anabolic Outlaws” is really the true title. No surprise that these guys avoid you at these competitions like roaches running when the “spotlight” is turned on. I thought it was a good analogy since bodybuilders as a whole are already avoiding the truth about their use. I mean look at the case with Jose Canseco coming out to the world about his use of steroids AND their use by other players…and their quick denials. I have greater respect for Jose because of his honesty…a sad lacking of the other players for being liars. Same thing with Craig Titus…I would have a lot of respect for him if he would just fess up to everything instead of letting the effect of his binges on steroids and drugs explain his actions. His actions in the past landed him in jail as they have done so now. Sit back and enjoy the upcoming proceedings as I say it will all come out in court. In solving this case the wheels of justice will turn slow and sure.

  39. ROCKMAN Says:

    This is so sad. If not, really stupid. CT and KR had it all. I really looked up to these guys. KR is so attractive and CT seems very conceded . Some of you may say steroids and drugs are to blame. I say very bad judgement on the part of CT and KR. If it is true about overdose, why didn’t they save themselves. Call the police, they could of been heroes. Heroes are not born, heroes are made. So what really happens? They say they covered it up. Make it look like she was raped. “stupid move” just dug there own graves. Gruesome, heinous, undescribeable acts to a unsecured, homeless beautiful girl. Yah, maybe she had problems with stealing and drugs, thats no reason to die. I feel for MJ’s family and friends. She chosed the wrong friends.CT and KR said MJ were there best friend and they loved her. Bullshit, Real friends should of helped her, not burn her. Real friends should of got her professional help. Real friends should of nurtured her. “Look” it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure this out. The evidence speaks for itself.

  40. WELL INFORMED!! Says:

    Ok i am the girlfriend of Deen Cassim. I follow this site on and off just to see people’s view’s of my boyfriend. I myself obiviously know alot about this case as i am very close to it thru Deen. Most of the people on this site obiviously don’t really know what’s going on with this case, believe me on that!! Also if it wasn’t for Deen 3 very important witnesses on this case would probably be dead by now. He did what any normal person would have done in this situation. He did’nt tell the police just for a deal, he had actually already been sentenced. When he was approached by Ron Brady he really felt that if he did’nt intervene 3 innocent people would die. If he did’nt play the part right then Ron would have found another hit man to do the job. There then would have been a risk to other people’s lives who could have been in the wrong place at the wrong time. Deen played the part of middleman to the hit man perfectly. If he just spoke on the phone to Ron like a pussy then what does that really show Ron? I’ll tell you, it shows Ron that he is dealing with a nobody. When you deal with a somebody you know it and you have to show it and act it. If he made 1 mistake then 3 people would be dead today!! let’s not forget who the guilty is here. It is certainly not Deen!! Just to let you know that the original charge that Deen was in jail for was based on Greg Raymer’s statement only. To this Deen has never given any interview’s to anybody, but he will be doing a interview within the next week or so to set the story straight. All Deen did to get himself in jail originally was to loan Greg Raymer a large amount of cash in a high stakes poker game in the Bellagio. Deen also was asked by Greg that same week could he get him a good looking hooker? Deen did and next thing Deen know’s is Greg has ripped her off for $1000 dollars. So now Greg wants to get slick with Deen and play dumb. This is what started the whole attempt robbery thing. In actuality what really happened was that Deen was’nt going to sit back and let this lying sack of shit named Greg Raymer rip him off, so he handled the old school way which is exactly what he admitted to. All in all this showed me that Deen is crazy mainly cuz he at the time was very well known in the Bellagio and he was staying in the penthouses of the casino. This was all comped by the Bellagio based on Deen’s credit within the casino which exceeded $1 million dollars. In fact from 2001 to 2004 Deen had stayed in the penthouses of the Bellagio a total of 9 mths. Deen also received comps for those 3 yrs in the amount of $59,000 dollars. This isn’t a robber, this is somebody who isn’ going to be ripped off by anybody no matter what the consequences are. The only reason Deen did’nt go to trial was because the Judge would’nt allow even 1 continuance in Deen’s case therefore showing Deen that he had no chance in front of Judge Bonaventure. His plan was to take the deal and then come back on appeal based on numerous reasons. This had always been the plan if the Judge kept showing his dislike of Deen which was very obivious. The main thing that Deen needed for his case was 4 dealer’s from the Bellagio that were going to testyfy that they knew Deen very well and that he was a very big player in the Bellagio. They were also going to testyfy to the fact that they witnessed Deen playin poker with Greg Raymer on at least 3 occassions. This statement alone would have been very important since Greg at the time was actually saying that he had never even met Deen Cassim. Problem was that the proscecutor in the case said she had’nt been informed early enough for Deen’s witnesses to testyfy on his behalf. Therefore Deen requested a continuance the first one only to have it denied by the Judge. Nevada law state’s that a defendant is allowed 3 continuances just like what is going on right now in the titus case. The Judge is the law in his courtroom especially Judge Bonaventure who does what he wants because he has been on the bench for so long. The Judge can do what he wants until the case get’s to the supreme crt and then it is tossed back for retrial based on many error’s by thr Judge. If a Judge is going to retire soon then what does he really care if he does things wrong. This is the same Judge that got Sandy Murphy convicted in the Binion high profile murder case only for her to appeal to the supreme crt getting the case tossed back for a new trial and then in the new trial she get’s found not guilty. She spent 4yrs in prison for a crime she did’nt committ.
    Look if you guys want to know the truth about Deen and the Titus case and Ron Brady then feel free to ask me the question’s and i will answer the question’s as best i can. I will even ask Deen direct for some answer’s that i can’t answer for you. One more thing for all you people who thing that Craig was’nt involved in the murder for hire plot with Ron Brady, PLEASE THINK AGAIN CUZ YOU WOULD BE SO WRONG TO ACTUALLY THING THAT CRAIG IS INNOCENT AND THAT RON WAS FORCED BY DEEN TO HIRE A HITMAN. C’MON I KNOW MOST OF YOU HAVE’NT BEEN INVOLVED WITH THE CRIMINAL ELEMENT BUT I HAVE FOR A FEW YRS NOW AND LET’S FACE IT THE EVIDENCE IN THE MURDER FOR HIRE PLOT AND THE MURDER OF MJ IS VERY STRONG. From everything that i know about these cases both Ron and Craig are guilty 100%…
    Sorry for this comment being so very long but it will definitely answer alot of question’s alot of you seem to have concerning Deen, Craig, and Ron Brady.

  41. darkstar Says:

    Well Informed,

    What you say is very interesting, but really doesnt mean shit to a tree…

    Problem number one is that regardless of the truth or lack of, you have a tremendously high bias in favor of your boyfriend and toward the theory that there is a murder for hire plot against witnesses in the Titus/Ryan case.

    In other words, “says you…”

    When you are asked to testify to same in court, the value and veracity will be weighed compared to the rest of the testimony.

    Have you been subpoened to testify, or has Deen? If so I am surprised that you are on this board, relating the “inside story” before the trial. I mean, lets face it…what people think on this board doesnt matter. Its an opinion board, nothing else, and certainly not a repository for evidence.

    Your post certainly adds grist for the mill, but hearsay it is, and hearsay it will remain.

    I will agree that Judge Bonerventure (misspelling intended) is a rude and cranky jurist. He proved that during Nevada v. Murphy/Tabish.


  42. Venice Says:

    Deem Cassim for President!

  43. Venice Says:

    Denny Bates for VP

  44. Johnny2007 Says:

    As ROCKMAN states: “Some of you may say steroids and drugs are to blame. I say very bad judgement on the part of CT and KR…” I say its when you m-i-x (1) the amount of steroids Craig did…PLUS (2) the amount of drugs (esp the crystal meth) they binged on…PLUS (3) their characters as a whole… ALL THIS TOGETHER contributed to their very bad judgement and actions that fateful night MJ was killed. Craig Titus’s actions showed he really needed to go to rehab a l-o-n-g time ago, rather than spending his first stint in jail and then returning to bodybuilding…and the roids…and the drug habit. I remember the vow he made after he got out of jail the first time…CT stated he was going to come back to bodybuilding…getting even bigger and stronger than Dorian Yates and Ronnie Coleman! That meant he needed to do “something” to grow that big…so I’m sure he was injecting even more juice than he ever did before. All that juice pumped into a person whose was a jerk already had to “explode” somehow…aka “roid rage”. *On a side note I took another look at the picture of him in jail…it blows my mind that without the use of steroids these bodybuilders are just a big fraud. I’d love to see Mr Yates…Mr Coleman…and all the others in this “profession” as you call it…really show what they are really made of without the juice. This case is all about the steroids used…the illegal drugs used…and the bad judgement used as a whole. In other words…guilty!

  45. neutral corner Says:

    So what your saying is that when Deen is not selling toy helicopters at gun shows - he is a high roller - a whale if you will - at one of the most prestigious casinos in Vegas…cool

  46. The Donald Says:

    Deen….ahem …I mean Deen’s girlfriend…

    I hear there is a lot of money to be made selling toy helicopters at gun shows in San Diego and elsewhere…

    Any information on this would be quite helpful.

    I’m thinking about liquidating my real estate assets and selling the rights to my tv shows and beauty pageants - so that I can sell toy helicopters at gun shows…


    Donald Trump

  47. The Donald Says:


    Donald Trump

  48. Click To Read Article Says:

    JS from Finland,

    You Wrote:

    What I meant with the question, that isn’t it kind of a contradiction that your saying that Weider includes satanic little hints, like obelisks and some satanic logos in their magazines, yet there’s a bodybuilder showing a tattooed cross, symbol of Christian religion, almost in every issue of their magazines. In my mind, you saying that Weider is trying to convert people with these satanic signs is as reasonable thing to say than if an atheist would say that Weider is trying to convert people to Christian religion.

    My Response:

    I have put together an article with examples in an attempt to clarify the answer to your question.

    Just click above where it reads: Click To Read Article

    Dennis L. Bates

  49. JoJo Says:


    People use the term The Bible of this or the Bible of that all the time - is that satanic?

    Obviously Weider has taken some liberties in incorporating the bible into his literature - but isn’t saying that’s he’s satanic taking it a little far?

    Is tom platz a satanist?

    Is kevin levrone a satanist?

    Is frank zane a satanist?

    I catch your drift - but aren’t you taking it a little far?

  50. Jason G Says:

    The “murder-for-hire” plot. This has been one of the more interesting ‘twists’ in this case. I for one do have many questions for any body who has good information. I agree with you that if Dean did what he did to save the lives of these 3 innocent witnesses, I too would like to thank him from the bottom of my heart. All of us who write on this Blog feel the pain this has caused these witnesses and the family and friends of Melissa.

    Tonight I looked on the in custody section of the Clark County Detention Center and see that Nelson Ronald Brady is set for the Premiminary Hearing tomorrow, February 1st. Now things will get interesting again.

    Here are some of the questions I would like to have answered. Is Dean going to testify at this hearing tomorrow? Is this when we will hear his story? Did Dean know Craig Titus? How did Brady know that Dean could help him find a hit man? Is it true that Dean called Brady over 100 times before Brady would meet with the police”?

    I can see why Dean had to be “tuff” and not act like a “pussy” to make sure that Brady did what he said and showed up at the meetings. I do question the amount of calls, (if 100 calls is true) as if it were me who wanted witnesses murdered, I wouldn’ make any calls and certainly not to or from the jail. Also, if I were facing 3 - 12 years in the state prison, I too would turn informant. The fact that he did this only to save the lives of witnesses is comendable at the least.

    One way or the other we should know more about this “plot” tomorrow.

  51. Jason G Says:

    Is the spelling “Dean” or “Deen”. Please accept my apology if I misspelled his name above.

  52. darkstar Says:

    Mr. Bates,

    I have read your article, and for the life of me I cannot see how you can make such a leap…

    Weider is nothing more than an ardent believer in self determination, that hard work, etc…is the way to successful body building…like JOJO said, analogies to well known biblical phrases are used in advertising all the time…I dont see any body running off to join Anton LaVey and the church of satan because of it…

    Weider is no satanist, and sure, people believe in his methods, or get paid by Weider to say they do…it’s advertising, not satanic brainwashing…

    Those who use drugs in their BB quest, well, there is always going to be those who want the path to be a bit less resistant. Too bad.

    You can believe what you want. Trying to enlighten BB’ers about the perils of drug use is a worthy cause. Accusing people of satanic cult conversion is not…

    I can only conclude that you are either insanely jealous of Weider, for what certainly appears to be misguided reasons, or you are just a complete nut, or both…


  53. Johnny2007 Says:

    Again…CT’s actions were a result of his drug and roid use affecting his persona…a lethal combo…period

  54. wayne mortensen Says:

    Hey, after seeing that video being wheeled out of his cell, and when I seen him on that cart, he looked so flabby. I guess that is why I never wanted to get muscle bound like CT, because when you quit lifting weights, you will look flabby like CT. (snicker snicker) This is now addressed to CTs lawyer, tell your client to mix some hair on that chrome dome and when you get ready for trial, shave and look presentable, not like some scary skin head.

  55. KNEW THEM Says:

    Johnny Boy, U don’t have a EFFin’ clue about Craig…the gay for pay & roid rages….you are waaay off dude! You are starting to get VERY irritating!

  56. JoJo Says:

    Mr. Bates:

    Why do you avoid fair questions and just continually try to drill home your short sighted mantra?

  57. knew them unlike you Says:

    Knew them:

    Here is a serious question for you, did you ever engage in illegal/illicte activities with the accused? Did you swing or do drugs? Did you sell to or buy from them?

    For someone so angered by others comments you seem too close to it all.

  58. darkstar Says:


    Bates isnt going to respond because he is a pussy…

    What’s it going to be Mr. Bates? Are you a man or a mouse?


  59. chainsaw Says:

    Everyone seems to think that when you’re muscular and you stop liftin you get flabby. Unreal, using someone in jail as an example is ridiculous. Usually, they don’t wish to get muscular because they are lazy.

  60. darkstar Says:

    Hey chain,

    I am not a BB myself, so I really dont know the intricate science of how it works, but isnt it true that if a person builds himself up great big like a CT or a similar BB’er, and then stops the workout routines (like if one is in jail, or simply stops working out) and changes the diet they are on, like CT going from arguably a bb diet to a jailhouse diet, that the person will experience a negative change in their physical appearance? Not to mention if they were using dope or steroids to assist in their BB endeavors…

    I mean, these bb’ers are pretty impressive when they are in top form, but I have to guess that it is a bitch to keep it in top shape…

    I guess my question is, doesnt the body atrophy to some extent if it isnt used or worked out as it would be in a bb program? Especially if your workout routine is cut off pretty much completely.

    Not sure I am explaining this right. Any thoughts? Thanks..


  61. Johnny2007 Says:

    Well…yeah…that’s my whole point with the roid thing. Bodybuilding these days is just a facade and a farce. I grant the hard work thing of going to the gym…but its the steroids that are making these guys like CT…and Yates…and Coleman et al the freakazoids they are. Its just a matter of what kind and how much juice you shoot up that produces the results. Once you’re off the roids its like letting the air out of the balloon. What’s funny is I would think CT gets at least an hour a day out in the yard for exercise. I thought these jails and prisons have weights…I mean when I see “Lock Up” on MSNBC all those in jail are out there pumping iron. Whats wrong with CT…is he that depressed that he just wants to puff on some cigarettes. What a role model he turned out to be! Yuck

  62. darkstar Says:

    Not sure, but I doubt they can smoke in the jail. Im guessing, but smoking is being banned everywhere indoors it seems like. Casinos are an exception, but just wondering if smoking is even allowed in jail.

    I think they banned it in the Texas department of corrections, and on death row…imagine that! Ban smoking on death row! I guess they dont want second hand smoke to cheat a condemned inmate’s date with the grim reaper…sheesh….


  63. Johnny2007 Says:

    Wow…I knew it…I knew it…I knew it. Just off the phone with a top 20 pro BB who gave me the lowdown on what happened in Vegas just before CT and KR took off across country. Seems like he was in Vegas to hook up with CT to get some juice and crystal…and the deal fell apart because he didn’t have the stuff (but wanted the money fronted to him to get the stuff) This really is the caper…I’m gonna try to sift thru the info I got before I saaaay any more. But this is the dirt I heard from the source!

  64. KNEW THEM Says:

    Answer to a Q posed to me: Most pros or soon to be know each other, see each other at shows, and compete against each other. Most of the time friendships are formed. We share info on training, dieting, supplements, and life….etc. The vast majority of TRUE bber’s don’t swing, pose for pay, or lower ourselves in THAT way. I’m not angry, but some comments like CT looks flabby..blah, blah, blah…understand one thing, he KNOWS he is fighting for his life. I don’t think he gives a shit about his abs right now. No, I don’t swing and never have. I have been behind bars before and I will leave it at that. I hope I answered your questions.

  65. JoJo Says:

    ….Wondering what else is going to come out before the trial starts…

    We hear so little about Kelly.

    I have very little doubt that CT and KR killed MJ, what has popped into my mind is this…

    Obviously CT and KR have conclusively b een pinned down on certain things…burning the body etc…

    …But will anyone be able to prove conclusively how MJ died…by that I mean the exact way in which she died…and secondly will the DA be able to prove whether it was Craig or Kelly? In other words what if they can conclusively narrow it down to either CT or KR commiting murder(as opposed to MJ od’ing on her own)- and CT and KR don’t turn on one another - then what?

    I don’t want to be insensitive to MJ or her family - but you know Saggese is going to dig up all the shit he possibly can to assault her character and history and I don’t think its going to be that hard to find. Ultimately I think they are guilty - but from a pragmaticly cold standpoint knowing something and being able to prove it are two different things…I’m also very curious about the murder for hire scheme and how it will impact the trial…I see a lot of opportunities for Saggese to muddy the waters with how Gross was manipulated so on and so forth - it seems that nearly every person in the trial has questionable character and that could be a problem - in that one respect it reminds me a little bit of the Robert Blake trial - his wife was obviously a schister- but who testified - drug addicted former stuntmen - bonnie blake’s character obviously was very easy to attack -and blakes atty was able to muddy the waters just enough to where people said, “well it could have happened this way, but hell it could have happened that way…I think Kelly is someone a jury would emphathize with - far more than Craig- in fact I don’t think the jury will emphathize with him at all - I’m not talking about the facts of the case - I’m just talking about perceptions…because perceptions will become reality for each individual juror…any chance in hell either one will take the stand? I could see Craig pushing to speak…

  66. KNEW THEM Says:

    I think Craig will take the stand, as I have always said…..it is too late for any damage control on his or his attorney’s part. They have both always admitted that he(CT) made a bad decision. I think Kelly will remain quiet as a mouse. I think CT knows he will do time for his mistake. I think Kelly being quiet won’t help her; they both are looking at a min. of 10 years.

  67. darkstar Says:

    Knew them,

    If CT takes the stand that will be just one more “bad decision” he will make…

    It is a huge risk… Daskas will come after him with cannons blazing. I think Saggese will do everything short of handcuffing CT to the defense table to keep him away from the stand…

    I agree with you that KR wont testify.

    I also think they are looking at a lot more than 10 years.

    Regardless, it will something to watch…


  68. KNEW THEM Says:

    D*: TRUST ME, if by some chance Craig doesn’t take the stand; he will at some point be thrown out of court(prob. more than once) for talking/disagreeing aloud. Their is NO way he will ever sit in court and let anyone accuse him of something that did not happen as they prob. will tell the story. I will continue to say that Craig and Saggese have both said that he(CT) is guilty of only bad judjement; meaning he didn’t kill MJ, he made a poor decision after MJ’s herion overdose. That is the story they will tell.

  69. darkstar Says:


    I hear ya, and you could be right. I can see CT being admonished by the judge to shut up, or even being removed from the courtroom…

    They may argue bad judgement, but they will have to refute the evidence as well, and some of it is pretty strong. If CT takes the stand he will be grilled mercilessly by the DA…

    As the old saying goes, ” the road to state prison is littered with defendants who took the stand…”


  70. shockandawe Says:

    Oh my God… I hope this whole thing is on CourtTV -I won’t be able to peel away. Craig will make an ass out of himself in court, as usual. His attorney will wish he didn’t ever take the case.

    Deen Cassim’s girlfriend posting (or whomever it was) was freaky.
    I do think whoever it is is right about one thing though…. we don’t have a clue what’s going to come out in this.

  71. KNEW THEM Says:

    Hey Shock: You and I both know that during the pros. opening statement that Craig will have to be asked to shut up by the judge more than once. I don’t even think he will make it to the Beginning of His attorney’s opening statement. What say U?

  72. Jason G Says:

    Hey Girlfriend! Girlfriend of Deen Cassim! aka WELL INFORMED.

    On Janurary 31st you said, “Look, if you guys want to know the truth about Deen and the Titus case and Ron Brady, (Nelson Brady?) then feel free to ask me the question’s and I (you) will answer the question…”

    YES WE WANT THE TRUTH and on the next day, February 1st I asked you a number of pertinent questions. We all would like to believe what you said about Deen, however, how can we believe what you say if you do not answer some of the simpler basic questions? Believe me we are waiting.

    By the way, the Nelson Brady preliminary hearing has been delayed until next Thursday, February 8th. The county website now says “To Appear” not preliminary, what ever that means.

  73. Chainwaw Says:

    Jason G

    Wow! Maybe Brady copped a plea, and they are waiving the preliminary hearing! Something is up. Maybe CT will be implicated on Brady’s testimony….. We’ll have to wait till Thursday I guess.

  74. darkstar Says:

    Thats an interesting thought…that would be a bombshell, wouldnt it?

    I kind of think though, it is just another typical delay…


  75. shockandawe Says:

    I think you’re right. And I think we should get the LV bookies to carry that bet. I think Craig will at least make exasperated noises, if not actually speak.

    I am still in disbelief that they will actually try these cases together. I think Kelly has a MUCH better chance to get off if she is tried separately from Craig. But part of me thinks that the worst of this is over for her… meaning, I do think she will put herself into a state to withstand her time.. and do it happily, because oddly, she is the kind of girl who has that champion any situation mentality. I am not glorifying her by saying that, people, I am just saying, I can see her faring well and doing ok. Better than Craig in certain ways.

    I don’t think he’s going to see the light of day ever again. I think he’ll be on death row.

  76. chainsaw Says:


    It looks rather interesting doesn’t it. I’m curious to see if you think this is a possibility, or what other reason there could be for the delay of Brady’s preliminary hearing….

  77. darkstar Says:


    Has the DA said whether thay will seek the death penalty in this case?

    If not, I do not think they will. Just a hunch.

    As for KR faring well in prison if convicted, Im not convinced of that, although I will demur to your personal friendship and knowledge of Kelly…state prison is not the county jail, however.

    But, who knows what will happen. This thing has got a long way to go…


  78. darkstar Says:


    Sure, its possible I suppose…Anything is possible, but not too probable.

    The delay is likely caused by some motion being filed, or some other request, or maybe someone was sick, or didnt have a report ready, or somebody couldnt make it to court, who knows…hearings get delayed all the time for stupid shit…

    But, if he is cutting a deal, that would be big news…I guess we will have to wait and see!


  79. Jason G Says:

    If Brady is cutting a deal that may be the reason we haven’t heard back from Cassim’s “girlfriend”. It would be nice to hear what he has to say.

    There must be some way to find out about what is going on at the Court. This has to be public information. The internet is full of information, I’m going hunting. I will let you all know IF I am successful.

  80. darkstar Says:


    If there is a transcript you may be able to get a copy of it. You may have to tell the court why you want it, and may have to pay a fee, but sometimes this is possible. I have no idea about Clark County regs on this.

    My only comment about deen cassim is that he appears to be a sleazy, wanna be tuff guy, a small time hood who will always have his fingers in somebody elses pie…a creep and a loser…just listen to those phone calls between him and Brady…


  81. chainsaw Says:


    I agree with you’re assesment of Casim. Also, I scan the LVRJ everyday in the Nevada section to check on any new Titus and Ryan stories. The ADM here is very good at reporting the news whichever way it fly’s. I wonder who it is (the admin) that is. I have a couple guesses.

    All court records here in Nevada I believe are public domain. That’s why we got the CT audio tapes as well as the Video.

  82. WELL INFORMED!! Says:

    OK this is Deen’s girlfriend here!! Been busy the last few days so haven’t had a chance to reply to some ??s you all asked. First of all for “neutral corner” and “the donald says” let me just enlighten you both on a few things that you are obiviously unaware of. Toy helicopter’s are a huge profit making business. I mean do you obiviously thing a girl like me would go out with a guy with no money, think again!! When Deen was arrested in San Diego he wasn’t there selling helicopter’s he was there to pick up his co-defendant Kevin. Now Kevin was selling the helicopter’s for Deen as Deen was the investor into the business. Deen had to pick up Kevin because at this time Kevin did’nt have a car and also Deen is looking out for his investment. I’ll give you a quick example of the profit to be made selling toy helicopter’s. You go to a location at a mall or a show of any kind, you pay approx $25-40 p/day for the rent on the location. Each toy helicopter costs $1.25 wholesale and when you sell them you charge $15.00 for one or two for $25.00. Now on a good weekend you can easily sell 500-600 helicopter’s and on a bad weekend you would sell at least 180. So your profit when all is said and done is at least $2500-$7500 for working a total of approx 1hr cuz all Deen does is put up the money to finance the business for each show etc etc. Now that above profit is for only one location, just imagine if you have 5 or 6 locations or even more. You do the math!!! So there we are selling toy helicopter’s is a very lucrative business and you would never know it would you. Now u non-business men know how to get rich if youv’e got the money and the know how!! Oh and let’s not forget the many other business deals that Deen is involved in. Good business sense is what creates a whale and gives him the ability to gamble big in Vegas!!
    Now just to let you know D* you seem to think you know alot about this case but let me tell you in the fewest words poss as i don’t have the time to debate this whole case with you but Deen can be on this board just as well as i and it does’nt affect the case. I know this for a fact 100% believe me!! The public knows only what is deemed neccessary for them to know, there are other things to this case in the background which only a law enforcement person or an attorney or even a bad guy who’s been thru the system a few times would really know. There are certain reasons why Titus hasn’t been charged yet all i can really say to you is just think real hard about it and look at the big picture and then you may if your lucky figure it out. You will hear Deen’s story publicly probably towards the end of this week and you will only hear what he feels the general public should know. Obiviously there are alot of media organisations trying to talk to Deen but he will only give his first and only interview for the time being very soon!! Brady knew to go to Deen because Brady got some info from a good friend that worked in the casino industry. When Brady found out who Deen was and where he was it just made the deal a whole lot easier and sweeter. Brady did alot of research into Deen before he approached him and i mean alot. Brady knew Deen was the right man to go to just based on his street creditbility and what he had been told. Brady was very much into doing this with Deen and Titus and that is so obivious if only you knew everything!! There are at least 25 phone calls where Deen is telling Brady that he does’nt have to have 3 witnesses killed to silence them. Deen said all that is needed is to intimidate them not to testyfy. Brady said that there is no way Titus can take that risk they have to be silenced forever etc etc. On many many occasions Deen try’s to pull out of the deal and tell’s Brady that he should go find somebody else to do the hit because it would be alot cheaper than going thru Deen but again Brady insisits on only working with Deen. In at least 10 calls Brady can be heard telling Deen to please give him another chance to do the deal and to just give him a little more time to get the $$$$ from Titus thru his Mom. Brady had to wait for the deal to go thru on Titus’s house so Brady and Titus could pay the full amount needed. The way Deen did everything in this murder for hire plot i think as well as many other people was very professional and the three witnesses involved should be saying there thanks in public for “Deen” cuz let’s face it if it wasn’t for Deen these 3 would definitely be dead today. When your facing life in prison without parole or the death penalty you do what you need to do especially if you have the money to do it. These 3 witnesses were much much better to Titus dead than alive, think about it. Deen played the part perfectly of the middle man to the actual hit man and should get an Oscar and at least $50,000 for his work. Even if i wasn’t Deen’s girlfriend i would still have the same opinion of him and for what he did. Any average person would have told the police immediately but only 1 in 100,000 people could have pulled this off to the extent of how Deen helped with this case. He should be an undercover cop for a living. I nominate Deen for the best actor oscar!!!
    Titus will in no way take the stand and Saggese won’t let him period!!! Titus can be hot headed and stupid but not that stupid!! KR could take the stand but she won’t cuz she isn’t that stupid as you can see from how she has acted from her arrest to today. Greg Denue knows how to keep quiet and how to keep his client quiet also!! On the other hand Saggese is not so quiet as he needs the publicity to make more $$$ in the future and get more clients. This case is a cheap way of getting big time advertising for Saggese and Cristalli and believe me Greg Denue is a much better attorney than Saggese and Cristalli put together x 5. Both Saggese and Cristalli would sell there client’s down the river if need be. As for Saggese staying on this case if he does’nt get paid, think again, he would do this case for free just based on the free advertising. You ask how do i know, well i know both Saggese and Cristalli very well.
    Sorry for the delay in my responses!! I will answer some more ??s tomorrow!!

  83. darkstar Says:

    Well Informed…

    If the toy helicopter biz is so lucrative, why would one involve themselves in the skanky vegas underbelly, and get busted for trying to rob a well known poker player, or get involved in a murder for hire plot (regardless of the ruse that it was to help the police…)and who knows what else…? A legitimate successful business man does not have connections to hit men and the criminal element. Maybe in your world…

    Face it, your “boyfriend” is a two bit hack, a wanna be tuff guy who is ultimately going to fuck up again and end up in jail. That’s the path, and for whatever reason, you seem to think that is glamourous…

    Your familiarity with the criminal system tells all one needs to know about where your head is at…that’s quite a charmed life you got there…hanging with stellar citizens like cassim and brady…go ahead and keep hanging with them…Im sure you have a bright future ahead of you…

    Most of what you are telling isnt all that relevant or revealing…..

    Sorry. No Oscar for Deen. However, you might get nominated for best-suck-up- to- my- boyfriend -fantasy -fiction -by -an -anonymous -self -proclaimed -well informed -loser-category…


  84. Jason G Says:

    Nice dance “Girlfriend”. Now answer the questions!

  85. Johnny2007 Says:

    JOHNNY2007 said: “Wow…I knew it…I knew it…I knew it. Just off the phone with a top 20 pro BB who gave me the lowdown on what happened in Vegas just before CT and KR took off across country. Seems like he was in Vegas to hook up with CT to get some juice and crystal…and the deal fell apart because he didn’t have the stuff (but wanted the money fronted to him to get the stuff) This really is the caper…I’m gonna try to sift thru the info I got before I saaaay any more. But this is the dirt I heard from the source…” Yep…this guy confirmed the story to me…and even some more. My bud was trying to score some hard-to-get steroids. CT didn’t have the product but could get it…but he also didn’t have the funds to cover the deal for him and wanted him to front the money (about $1000) and this was a couple days before he split on his cross country trip. My friend backed out of the deal and got them somewhere else. I can tell you the stuff my bud ended up with was real good because he looked great in contest shots a few months later. I have also heard that CT and KR actually made their own home-brewed meth…producing it in a jar-sized container…not on a mass scale as you hear when these “labs” blow up the neighborhood. I hear this is becoming a more common thing as the Fed’s close down big labs and sources. It also may explain how and why they were able to travel cross-country so quickly…they were up on the stuff for days. Also it also explains why a guy the age of CT (and KR) looks so old and worn out than they should look. Look at early pictures of Craig from the 90’s…it speaks for itself

  86. darkstar Says:


    OK, and the relevance of this is???


  87. Canadian Connection Says:

    Well Informed!!!,

    An exclamation mark (also exclamation point, and, rarely, mark of admiration) is a punctuation mark. Like the full stop (or period), it marks the end of a sentence. A sentence ending in an exclamation mark is either an actual exclamation (”Wow!”), a command (”Stop!”), or is intended to be astonishing in some way (”They were the footprints of a gigantic hound!”).

    Is there really the need for 30(yes 30 !!!) exclamations marks!!!! Use some DISCRETION!!!!

  88. darkstar Says:

    Canadian Connection!!!!!
    I agree!!!


  89. shockandawe Says:

    FUCK YEAH, MY BROTHERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  90. Disgusted Says:

    Well Informed: What color is the sky in your world?

  91. WELL INFORMED!! Says:

    Well it seem’s i was right about 1 thing and that’s the fact that most of you are wannabee’s. You can talk the talk but you can’t walk the walk!! Jealous of Deen and CT is how it all sounds with all the comments that most of you make. I don’t have the time that all of you have, obiviously as i have a life. Most of you especially D* and Chain are obiviously x druggies who make $6 p/hr doing an immigrants job and living in a studio apt or maybe a 1bdr apt if your lucky!! You comment that the criminal element are bad people, well the world is what it is and always will be. D* and Chain can only ever dream to be like Deen. SHAME ON YOU!!! At least he isn’t at home viewing child porn like D* and Chain. DISGUSTING!!! You guys would never survive in jail or prison so make sure that you never go!!! I would have answered you ???s in detail but since it seems that most of you have it in for Deen when you don’t know even half the truth i will at least leave you with a little taster of what you could have known. Brady is up to something believe that and that would bring out the truth but i already know what the truth is, it’s you on this forum who don’t. Also for all you wannabee’s and dummie’s the DA Robert Daskas is one of the top 2 DA’s in the Clark County office and he got there for being one of the best. This case has already been mapped out and planned. You can all just wait alot longer for the truth about the CT case and just a little longer for the truth about the Brady case. I will tell you this though the only reason that CT has’nt been charged with murder for hire YET is cuz the charges can be brought any time. If CT is charged now then Daskas has to separate the trial of CT and KR. CT will get found “guilty” regardless but KR would have a better chance at beating the case without going to trial with CT. Why would Daskas take the chance when there is no need to. Also by trying CT on a later date after the murder case gives CT a consecutive sentence once he is found “guilty”, on top of the murder sentence. Daskas does’nt want CT on the streets again so therefore is planning well ahead so he gets what he wants. I know what Brady is up to but you can all find out when the rest of the public does.
    FUCK YOU D*.

  92. darkstar Says:

    Well Informed NOT,

    Let me break it down for you, ya schmuck…

    First, you know nothing about me, or Chain, or Disgusted, or Shock…NOTHING…
    Got that? Nada…

    We know nothing about you, except that you appear to prefer hanging with criminal scum like your slimeball daddy Deen…and spewing your skanky shit all over this board…

    Your “insight” into this case, particularly the Brady case, is nothing new. This board has discussed why CT hasnt been charged and the legal strategies surrounding it for weeks now. You are late to the party…and you are not the least bit enlightening…entertaining, yes…much like the village idiot…

    You also seem to hold yourself out as having quite a bit of experience with the criminal justice system, claiming that we could not survive in jail…Now, why is that? It must be YOUR experience, because you certainly know ZERO about what our capabilities or accomplishments are…

    Now why dont you just slink back to the compost heap from whence you and your creepy convict boyfriend sprang, and be a good little cretin…you arent impressing anyone here…you arent tough…you are a chump and a loser.


  93. Chainsaw Says:


    I specifically didn’t respond to well informed, because I know that well informed would lash out like a little juvenile sooner or later, and it happened sooner than expected. The mouth that that chick has, my gosh. She obviously has no idea who she’s talkin too. She needs to sober up a bit I think.

  94. darkstar Says:


    I hear ya…

    It is amazing to me what some people’s perceptions of success and accomplishment are…her words speak for themselves….

    It would be laughable if it wasnt so twisted…


  95. KNEW THEM Says:

    Shock: I think Craig and Kelly’s attorney’s will slowly space themselves from each other…..As strange as it sounds, I think Kel will be held more liable. I have a feeling Saggese will paint Craig (and he was) the one who tried to put seperation between Kel and MJ.(The hotel, plane ticket, MJ’s conversation w/her mom). Craig liked himself too much to kill someone, and he took many chances over the years, but killing wasn’t his thing. Craig was always honest to me and helped many people I knew. Could he have changed…sure, but a killer, I doubt it.

  96. Chainsaw Says:

    Knew them:

    What about Kelly, was she capable of it?

  97. shockandawe Says:

    Here’s what ILL INFORMED had to say:

    You comment that the criminal element are bad people, well the world is what it is and always will be. D* and Chain can only ever dream to be like Deen. SHAME ON YOU!!! At least he isn’t at home viewing child porn like D* and Chain. DISGUSTING!!! You guys would never survive in jail or prison so make sure that you never go!!!

    Then she said:
    FUCK YOU D*.

  98. shockandawe Says:

    HUH????????? Don’t know what I did, but whatever.

    First off, don’t know how I got the FUCK YOU thrown my way. Not that I care, but it was odd. She had a major meltdown there. Maybe it was a Midol/ Playtex/ maxi rag moment. Not sure.

    Okay, but what’s up with this dipshit glorifying prison and convicts????
    I just started laughing…. “You all think the criminal element are bad people”…. uhhh. YEAH!!!? AND? Hey Brain Trust, we know you sound enamored of your convict boyfriend and of CT, but uhhhh… I have a hot newsflash for you: Most people think your boyfriend, CT and others like him and Brady are SCUM OF THE EARTH.

    I love how this unstable chick makes life inside, and macho ex-convict things sound so glamorous, and makes her scumbag boyfriend out to be a friggin’ hero for NOT killing someone. Besides, “WE CAN ONLY DREAM TO BE LIKE DEEN” swoon…swoon….swoon.

    D, Chain, Knew…. you guys better sign up for the Rocko Clubbo School of Gentlemanly Conduct, like Deen.

    Yeah, he sounds like a real saint honey. You’ve found the man your mom always hoped you would. Yeah, don’t worry, we’ll make sure we never commit stupid crimes. Don’t you worry about us.

    The reference to child porn escapes me. BUT, since she brought it up, is it some odd attempt at confessing that her daddy touched her in a naughty place and that’s why she chose a guy like Deeno? Hmmmmmm….

    Sounds like a confession to me.

    Honey, tell us, do you have a baby voice? You know, Howard Stern always says that baby-voiced adult women have been molested. I predict you either sound like MA BARKER on Jack, Coke and Marlboros, or like a pony-tailed 9 year old diddling herself in the closet while she waits for daddy’s friends to come over and have their way with her.

    Just a thought…. errr…. ;)

  99. KNEW THEM Says:

    Chain: I would rather comment to questions directed about Craig; I have known him since way before he was a pro. Kelly, my best guess would be to say no. I can’t really get into her mind-set though; maybe someone on this board has known her before and after CT.

  100. KNEW THEM Says:

    Shock: Why waiste the time? Hey Shock: Craig knew so many guys who have been on the national scene for a long time, I’m surprised many of them have not wrote in. Many guys on other blogs have known him for as long as me and longer; I wonder if his ol’ friend Jay C. has any comments? What about Phil H.? What about Tom P.? Even Vince Neil? What about Dennis N.? What about Lee P? The list could go on and on. Guess they just roll their eyes and don’t care or give a shit. They went their way and he went his. Well Jay went his way even when he hung w/ Craig. Very devoted to his wife, girlfriend at the time.(very devoted,the girl I saw him turn down….WOW.) No doubt he’s a stand up guy.

  101. shockandawe Says:

    Well, one of those guys you mentioned … I don’t know if you mean Tom P. the pro or Tom P. at Gold’s in Venice. The latter has actually gone to see him, so….

    Yeah, but remember, all of those guys are out for themselves. AND, I will say, knowing each one of them for years, (except Vince Neil, whom I do not know) never really got on with Craig or were his buddies, you know? I mean, they all had the pro card in common, but apart from that, CT was never buddies just a “hi bro” or nod in their direction, friendliness, etc… But I’d say that they probably do roll their eyes because, I mean, can you blame them,? Most people cannot relate to this bud, you have to admit.

    Yeah, Jay is a very stand up guy who is loyal and has his head on straight, apart from obvious things he must do to be a pro. Some of those things don’t go hand in hand, but he makes it all work and you have to admire him. Though, a guy like Jay C. distances himself - politely - from the stench, so to speak. It’s the reason you see him in a positive light, never hear crap about him, and never see him behaving badly. You don’t get that rep if you do anything wrong in this sport - you know this.

    I do know where you’re coming from - I can hear you struggle with all of this like I do (with Kel, since she was once my good friend) - it’s hard. I know you don’t want to openly defend someone you know did a bad crime - I don’t either - but you knew that person before they declined so very badly. I mean, it’s really sad and hard to watch or accept.

    So that’s no bleeding heart shit, but I have to say, I probably know where you’re coming from better than most, though I don’t know you.

    You can send a message to me on getbig.com to the same name if you want to tell me who you are. You don’t have to either, because I’m not sure I will. But… you know… if you want to say something outside this board. It’s hard to find sympathetic people who can identify with the “I knew him/ her when” comments, because everyone wants to lynch them. Which, I understand too.. and don’t begrudge. What they did - allegedly - is heinous and I want justice for Melissa’s sake, for sure. I am unbending on that. But… it still makes you sad to remember…

  102. KNEW THEM Says:

    Boy Shock, I hear you on that shit. It’s just sad all the way around. It seems that bbers and former ones(myself included) would only harm themselves and not others. I don’t know, I just always pull for the underdog. The bbing sport will never reach mainstream, and so many people never understand the life, dedication, minute by minute persuit to make one’s self better. Hell, if every person dieted for just 1 month the way we did or do, the sport would be sooo appreicated. I hate when people look at bbers as self centered, attention seeking steroid experiments.

  103. KNEW THEM Says:

    Shock: Another sad story of a good guy that has been lost is Paul De. Damn opiates, love to hate em. Don’t you think Lee P’s erratic decisions and rambalings is a result of nub? Talk with yall tomorrow night.

  104. KNEW THEM Says:

    Johnny Quest: Please dude, no more blogging after U hit your meth pipe.

  105. shockandawe Says:

    Paul De is a very sad story. I knew big Paul from 1991 on and he was a great guy when he was doing well. I used to love him say “wicked awesome” after everything he said. He was a fun dude.

    Yep. Very sad. Drugs are really shitty.
    I’m sure I’m in the minority, but I feel really badly that Anna Nicole Smith couldn’t get out from under. What an f’in beautiful woman. Funny, too. Not the smartest, but seemed really sweet. Sad.

  106. darkstar Says:


    Not sure you are in the minority on this…sure, she was ditzy, but she did seem to have a lot of demons inside…thats always a killer, especially for someone like her…

    I could care less about her celebrity…aside from that, she had a lot of shit to deal with, what with her son, a new baby, all the lawsuits…and who knows what other stuff….very sad.


  107. shockandawe Says:

    Yeah, I guess since I’ve gotten older, I have a really hard time just ruthlessly attacking and lambasting someone. It is too brutal for me. All of the fat jokes and drunk jokes and drug jokes and stupid jokes… It had to kill her her whole life to hear that. She did a LOT better in her life than a lot of the losers who criticize her. I’d like to see the couch jockeys who throw mud her way.. they’re probably fat, sweaty losers too.

    A friend of mine used to say, “Yeah, all of these guys call women who are carrying the least amount of excess weight, FAT, yet they’re about as far from perfect themselves…” I thought that was very true. When you go to strip clubs, guys are really ruthless and ugly if a girl is the least bit imperfect, yet he has a gut, is broke and is ugly and couldn’t get laid if he tried. Or, if he can, he’s usually the type who’s so dysfunctional, he couldn’t manage to act mature in a relationship.

    Anna Nicole actually made something of herself. She had a LOT of demons, AND a lot of people trying to get a piece of her, all the time.
    That mother and step sister of hers make me SICK!

  108. ROCKMAN Says:

    Just wondering, when is the trial date? Anybody know? Let me know.

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